tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post3287123219115392077..comments2024-03-27T16:48:21.039-05:00Comments on Wuthering <br>Expectations: life is probably nothing other than happiness - Jean Anouilh and Anne Carson adapt Greek plays, and Jean Giraudoux adapts something elseAmateur Reader (Tom)http://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-65715357232353447122021-12-08T17:52:50.378-06:002021-12-08T17:52:50.378-06:00"Calculated," yes that's where I'..."Calculated," yes that's where I'm at, and the idea that it's some kind of Resistance play seeming especially far-fetched. Retroactive.<br /><br />My favorite Anouilh play at this point is an early, farcical one, <i>Le bal de voleurs / The Thieves' Ball</i> (1938), a farce with an edge.<br /><br />I have not seen the film, and will keep an eye out for it. I can watch stuff like that.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-73569788792494777472021-12-08T16:48:17.815-06:002021-12-08T16:48:17.815-06:00I remember hating Anouilh's 'Antigone'...I remember hating Anouilh's 'Antigone' when I read it nearly 20 years ago. The ambiguity (pro- or anti-Vichy?) seemed rather calculated, and that sentimental nonsense with the dog was nauseating. Perhaps I should give it another go - or read some more Anouilh.<br /><br />Have you seen the Straub/Huillet film of Antigone? This is Sophocles via Hölderlin via Brecht. The actors are directed to be as stilted as possible, pausing rigidly at the end of every line even if the clause runs on. I don't think there's any camera movement (or if there is, it's minimal); the shots are composed with an austere precision. Real love it/hate it cinema - I loved it. Mimic Hootingshttps://mimichootings.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-16393943941117648182021-12-03T08:28:55.268-06:002021-12-03T08:28:55.268-06:00Yes, I immediately made a serious error. I am sur...Yes, I immediately made a serious error. I am sure more will follow. The best part of the internet is the error-correction. Which I have not done yet. Hang on.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-56928490878197723972021-12-03T01:01:34.487-06:002021-12-03T01:01:34.487-06:00I was wondering if you were counting Menander at 4...I was wondering if you were counting Menander at 44, but then Rhesus is an odd bird, too, so I could see glossing over that...reesehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15818057262934008241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-81401480025771272202021-12-02T15:33:57.128-06:002021-12-02T15:33:57.128-06:00I'm going to count Menander as two, I guess, a...I'm going to count Menander as two, I guess, although I counted him as one above, and also apparently mentally blocked <i>Rhesus</i>, since I was counting Euripides as 18, not 19.<br /><br />So, 45 complete survivors which I will make a 46 week project. So glad you'll join in somewhere. Maybe I'll move on to Latin plays afterwards, although reading all of Plautus seems a little redundant. But it is the Romans we need for Shakespeare and so on.<br /><br />I don't know when the Greeks really spread. When Ben Jonson compared Shakespeare to "thundering Aeschylus, Euripides, and Sophocles," who really knew what he meant? Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-6912411926484899812021-12-02T07:22:09.343-06:002021-12-02T07:22:09.343-06:00I'm always reading the Greek plays, so I can h...I'm always reading the Greek plays, so I can happily join in. There's more or less 1 extent play of Menander too, and of course really Plautus and Terence are Greek plays, just written in Latin and given a roman context. Interesting to compare with Menander.<br /><br />I'm intrigued when Greek tragedy became known in the modern world. It doesn't seem to be known at all in Shakespeareab times, or afaik spanish drama, but Racine is clearly very influenced.<br /><br />obookinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-86320720514198085042021-12-01T08:40:00.392-06:002021-12-01T08:40:00.392-06:00It clearly helped Anouilh get a pass.
Carson has ...It clearly helped Anouilh get a pass.<br /><br />Carson has a strong flavor, that is for sure. A salt licorice kind of writer.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-71758640414364165542021-12-01T08:27:10.200-06:002021-12-01T08:27:10.200-06:00The play’s major theme of “duty to the state” vers...<i> The play’s major theme of “duty to the state” versus “duty to something else” (the gods in Sophocles, perhaps the self in Anouilh) sounds like the perfect way to get in trouble with Nazi censors, but no, they seemed all right with the debate. </i><br /><br />This is exactly why so many Russian and Soviet historians-in-training went into Roman/ancient history; they could say things that they'd never get away with if they were dealing with more recent events. Censors are often remarkably stupid.<br /><br />Thanks for the Carson excerpts; they've convinced me she's Not My Thing.Languagehathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13285708503881129380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-58300089222227618842021-11-30T21:58:03.423-06:002021-11-30T21:58:03.423-06:00A mix is exactly what I have read, including many ...A mix is exactly what I have read, including many of those U of C translations. I'll make some comments about translations but really there are now a lot of plausible versions of most of the plays. Given that I have no Greek, and know nothing, at least.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-5634791444898512792021-11-30T20:24:55.114-06:002021-11-30T20:24:55.114-06:00Reading the Greek plays sounds good. I think I'...Reading the Greek plays sounds good. I think I've got about half of them in the old University Of Chicago translations - it would be interesting to read a mix of translators, I wonder how much difference it would make.dollymixnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-5569166562839974992021-11-30T19:49:56.870-06:002021-11-30T19:49:56.870-06:00Yes, whatever prompt works, however it works.Yes, whatever prompt works, however it works.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-70819565403602379292021-11-30T18:39:45.266-06:002021-11-30T18:39:45.266-06:00Definitely interested, although I probably won'...Definitely interested, although I probably won't manage all of them. I have about 8 or 9 that have been on my shelves for years, so it's about time!amanda @ simplerpastimeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14127945915013121105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-7018031255338016312021-11-30T11:14:27.232-06:002021-11-30T11:14:27.232-06:00Outstanding, and congratulations!Outstanding, and congratulations!Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-65861360086555045032021-11-30T09:49:39.693-06:002021-11-30T09:49:39.693-06:00"resignation""resignation"Jeannehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17975028272143207826noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-18027834447577883842021-11-30T09:48:45.161-06:002021-11-30T09:48:45.161-06:00I'm interested, since it's next year. I...I'm interested, since it's next year. I've announced early retirement at the end of July 2022--kind of taking part in the "great resignaton"--and intend to spend time on more worthwhile things.Jeannehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17975028272143207826noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-79598107989200427732021-11-29T22:07:34.783-06:002021-11-29T22:07:34.783-06:00In Greek, that would be some fun. Good, please joi...In Greek, that would be some fun. Good, please join in. Come to think of it, I've read <i>Oedipus Rex</i> in French. All languages are welcome!<br /><br />Maybe later in December, or in early January, I'll post a schedule of some kind and pump it up on Twitter.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-6505518606058898892021-11-29T20:53:19.428-06:002021-11-29T20:53:19.428-06:00I'd join in for a Greek play read-along. Maybe...I'd join in for a Greek play read-along. Maybe I'd even think about reading some of them in Greek. (But probably not...)<br /><br />Euripides is da man.reesehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15818057262934008241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-87388197990019930312021-11-29T19:23:54.329-06:002021-11-29T19:23:54.329-06:00They're easier than Shakespeare! Generally. An...They're easier than Shakespeare! Generally. And also a lot shorter. The first four Aeschylus plays, for example, are about 30 pages each in the Penguin editions.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-63231419680621868472021-11-29T18:59:28.847-06:002021-11-29T18:59:28.847-06:00I've not read any Greek play. Reading them wit...I've not read any Greek play. Reading them with you sounds like a good idea, but I'm intimidated.Hai Di Nguyenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02230670162621139739noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-30312759830826305042021-11-29T18:46:42.507-06:002021-11-29T18:46:42.507-06:00All right, maybe I'll do this. I've had w...All right, maybe I'll do this. I've had worse ideas.<br /><br />I am really only committing myself to read them all - what suffering, what hardship - but anyone else could join with whatever seems interesting.<br /><br />I am myself a kind of a Euripidean, so I think they are all of the highest interest, even when they are not good. The same is true of Aristophanes, really.<br /><br />I just knocked up a timeline, and the idea of doing a semi-chronological reading is not bad, so Sophocles, Euripides, and Aristophanes would be mixed together.Amateur Reader (Tom)https://www.blogger.com/profile/13675275555757408496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3383938214852108244.post-45170907392525646202021-11-29T16:42:39.015-06:002021-11-29T16:42:39.015-06:00Re re-reading the Greeks: I'd be in when you g...Re re-reading the Greeks: I'd be in when you get to Aristophanes and Euripides. I've read fewer than half of E's and only two of A's. I'm not ready to revisit the Theban plays or the Oresteia.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.com